You are not logged in. Would you like to login?
- Grandfather
- Member
Offline - Registered: 11/18/2018
- Posts: 230
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Welcome to the group Tim. I dont believe he has convinced himself that he did not commit the murders. He knows he did it. But he doesn't care. He never did. He didnt feel any guilt, even in the beginning, when he cooled down from his explosion of rage where he bludgeoned his wife and oldest daughter viciously. At that point he ruminated for a short time over his options, and decided his best course of action was to kill the youngest daughter and fabricate the hippy story. That is why Kristen was killed not with rage, but with clinical precision. And all his actions since then have been one long acting job. Laying down next to his wife's body when the MPs arrived and starting to cough or choke as they walked in the room ensured their attention was drawn to him and they viewed him as a victim and not a perp.
In a previous post I talked about how he smirked during the April 6th 1970 interview when the police mixed up the daughters names. He knew exactly which daughter they were talking about, because he inflicted their injuries. He began to correct them, but stopped in midsentence because he realized that an innocent man would not know exactly what happened to each child.
Then he made subtle changes to his story as he learned more about what evidence the investigators had. In the April 6 interview he didnt talk about moving his wife. By the article 32 hearing a few months later, he knew fibers from his pygama top had been found under her body. Under his initial version of events where he fought with intruders in the living room, then later found his wife in the bedroom where he then took off the pygama top and laid it over his wife, there would be no fibres under her body. So he modified his story and now claimed he had found her in a sitting position leaning against the chair, and then moved her to the floor.
When he was working as a doctor in California during the 1970's, people noticed his rock steady sense of calm in the emergency room, along with his cheerful and breezy disposition, and assumed it was a sign of good character. From that assumption they concluded he must have been innocent, because a good person could not have done that.
All through the appeals to SCOTUS to delay the trial, the trial itself, then all the appeals through the 80's and 90's and beyond, he knew what he did, but he didnt think it mattered. After all, the victims are dead. They can't be brought back. But he should be able to live his life, right? Because he is still here.
And besides, it was their fault for making him mad. Except for Kristen, which is why he has had difficulty talking about her over the years.
So he knew back then what he did, and there is no indication that has changed.
It is an interesting question though, what his mental state is now. Have the long years in prison diminished his mental capacity? Have the effects of old age begun to set in, where he may not be certain in his own mind of events that happened many decades ago? I dont know the answer to those questions. In the past he did long interviews with magazines such as Playboy, and from his answers we could glean some sense of his state of mind. But to my knowledge he has not done that type of interview in a long time. For the last decade or more his wife has been doing the talking. So we have insight into her state of mind (and it is not pretty). But not his. Even at his last parole hearing in 2005 he didnt speak much. And all through that ridiculous appeal hearing in 2012, I dont recall him speaking or giving interviews.
When he uses the term "innocent" he means it in a legal sense. Like OJ being innocent because he was not convicted. But in the case of JRM, it is a stretch, because he was convicted. But in his mind, he should have been found innocent, because the jury should have found reasonable doubt. They didn't, but he always clung to his latest appeal attempt and operated under the assumption that eventually the conviction would thrown out under some technicality such as speedy trial. And since he has always been confident that would happen, he makes the claim of innocence. One thing JRM has never lacked is confidence.
Last edited by Grandfather (2/14/2021 6:34 am)
- Tim2020
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 2/07/2021
- Posts: 79
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Grandfather wrote:
Welcome to the group Tim. I dont believe he has convinced himself that he did not commit the murders. He knows he did it. But he doesn't care. He never did. He didnt feel any guilt, even in the beginning, when he cooled down from his explosion of rage where he bludgeoned his wife and oldest daughter viciously. At that point he ruminated for a short time over his options, and decided his best course of action was to kill the youngest daughter and fabricate the hippy story. That is why Kristen was killed not with rage, but with clinical precision. And all his actions since then have been one long acting job. Laying down next to his wife's body when the MPs arrived and starting to cough or choke as they walked in the room ensured their attention was drawn to him and they viewed him as a victim and not a perp.
In a previous post I talked about how he smirked during the April 6th 1970 interview when the police mixed up the daughters names. He knew exactly which daughter they were talking about, because he inflicted their injuries. He began to correct them, but stopped in midsentence because he realized that an innocent man would not know exactly what happened to each child.
Then he made subtle changes to his story as he learned more about what evidence the investigators had. In the April 6 interview he didnt talk about moving his wife. By the article 32 hearing a few months later, he knew fibers from his pygama top had been found under her body. Under his initial version of events where he fought with intruders in the living room, then later found his wife in the bedroom where he then took off the pygama top and laid it over his wife, there would be no fibres under her body. So he modified his story and now claimed he had found her in a sitting position leaning against the chair, and then moved her to the floor.
When he was working as a doctor in California during the 1970's, people noticed his rock steady sense of calm in the emergency room, along with his cheerful and breezy disposition, and assumed it was a sign of good character. From that assumption they concluded he must have been innocent, because a good person could not have done that.
All through the appeals to SCOTUS to delay the trial, the trial itself, then all the appeals through the 80's and 90's and beyond, he knew what he did, but he didnt think it mattered. After all, the victims are dead. They can't be brought back. But he should be able to live his life, right? Because he is still here.
And besides, it was their fault for making him mad. Except for Kristen, which is why he has had difficulty talking about her over the years.
So he knew back then what he did, and there is no indication that has changed.
It is an interesting question though, what his mental state is now. Have the long years in prison diminished his mental capacity? Have the effects of old age begun to set in, where he may not be certain in his own mind of events that happened many decades ago? I dont know the answer to those questions. In the past he did long interviews with magazines such as Playboy, and from his answers we could glean some sense of his state of mind. But to my knowledge he has not done that type of interview in a long time. For the last decade or more his wife has been doing the talking. So we have insight into her state of mind (and it is not pretty). But not his. Even at his last parole hearing in 2005 he didnt speak much. And all through that ridiculous appeal hearing in 2012, I dont recall him speaking or giving interviews.
When he uses the term "innocent" he means it in a legal sense. Like OJ being innocent because he was not convicted. But in the case of JRM, it is a stretch, because he was convicted. But in his mind, he should have been found innocent, because the jury should have found reasonable doubt. They didn't, but he always clung to his latest appeal attempt and operated under the assumption that eventually the conviction would thrown out under some technicality such as speedy trial. And since he has always been confident that would happen, he makes the claim of innocence. One thing JRM has never lacked is confidence.
Thanks Grandfather, also interesting that the coffee table was never brought into evidence. Top heavy as you know but was found on its side. I always felt that was an important point.
- Tim2020
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 2/07/2021
- Posts: 79
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Hi One Who Cares!
- Grandfather
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 11/18/2018
- Posts: 230
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Tim - The coffee table was interesting, an indication of staging. But I would put it in the 2nd level of evidence. Part of a puzzle, a piece that fits, and when you have enough pieces, the image becomes clear.
In that level I would include
4 hippies walking around a military base unnoticed.
Arriving on a murder spree mission with no weapons.
Attacking women and children first instead of the only person in the house who was a legitimate threat to them.
Disposing weapons a few meters from the back door.
The ridiculous story of a hippy girl holding a candle and chanting "acid is groovy, kill the pigs."
And many more pieces to the puzzle.
But there is also top level evidence that is devastating on its own, and doesn't need to be a piece of a puzzle.
In that category I would put the coincidence of all 4 family members having different blood types. That allowed the investigators to see clearly who was attacked where in the house.
The fibre evidence. A profusion of fibres in the bedroom showed the fight occurred there and not in the living room where no fibres were found.
JRM's ripped pocket on his pyjama top was stained with Colette's blood BEFORE it was ripped. When you put the ripped piece back together, the two halfs of the stain go together.
The holes in his pyjama top showed it was on Colette's chest when she was being stabbed. And he admits he put it over her.
And the bloody footprint in Colette's blood leaving Kristen's room is particularly devastating evidence. This link explains its significance:
Last edited by Grandfather (2/18/2021 5:58 am)
- Grandfather
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 11/18/2018
- Posts: 230
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Tim - I looked into the coffee table a bit more. It turns out that the investigators felt it was important evidence in the beginning, but it didn't go well for them at the Article 32 hearing.
From an article last year:
"The investigators contended that there was no way that the MacDonalds’ living room coffee table would have ended up on its side during a struggle. They said they repeatedly knocked it over to try to recreate the fight conditions that MacDonald described and it always landed upside down on the floor. This was evidence, they said, that MacDonald staged the scene.
The presiding officer decided to see for himself. He went to the MacDonald residence and kicked the table. It landed on its side."
Then the CID did an analysis of the table, and submitted a report:
During the 1979 trial I dont think they used the coffee table, because it was the kind of evidence where the jury might find reasonable doubt.
It also might remind the jury of the sloppiness of the initial moments of the investigation, where someone stood up a flower pot that had been knocked over. The jury might conclude that the coffee table had also been moved. Or it may have been.
And they had so much other evidence, they decided to leave it alone.
Unfortunately, this is exactly the kind of evidence that Mac followers have clung to over the years. They ignore mountains of devastating evidence, and focus on a few pieces of ambiguous evidence to find reasonable doubt.
Last edited by Grandfather (2/19/2021 9:39 am)
- Spifflog
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 10/05/2020
- Posts: 15
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Unfortunately, this is exactly the kind of evidence that Mac followers have clung to over the years. They ignore mountains of devastating evidence, and focus on a few pieces of ambiguous evidence to find reasonable doubt.
As you noted, this is the crux of virtually all arguments for his innocence. (And are mirrored by many conspiracy theories, I might add.) The coffee table evidence is very solid, but it takes a mere two or three sentence to explain it, which is just too much for many to take the time to digest or acknowledge.
MacDonald defender: "The article 32 hearing said the coffee table proved MacDonald was framed!"
Reasonable man: "No. That's not what was said. The Army investigators stated that the coffee table was almost certainly staged, as it was impossible, on it's own to tip over and remain on its side. There was a minor possibility that it bumped up against another object and remained on it's side. But in light of the litany of other solid evidence, it this wasn't needed in subsequent court proceedings. There is a concise Army report on it."
MacDonald defender: "See, the Army was incompetent!"
- •
Thread Starter- Christina Masewicz
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 11/16/2018
- Posts: 65
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Some information to those who are interested-
As to MacDonald's compassionate release filings
MacDonald submitted an informal request for compassionate release (BP-8) to the Warden at FCI Cumberland on April 10, 2020. Request was denied on April 24, 2020. In denying his request, the Warden acknowledged MacDonald's "medical concerns," but found that because he was "able to function in correctional setting," his request for a compassionate release was not appropriate at that time.
He then filed a formal Request for Administrative Remedy (BP-9) on May 13, 2020. His request was again denied on June 3, 2020.
On June 9, 2020, he filed a Regional Administrative Remedy (BP-10)
On September 10, 2020, he received a response informing him that his appeal was denied. In the response Regional Director acknowledged MacDonald's "medical concerns," but nonetheless, denied his appeal based on MacDonald's classification as "Simple Chronic Care" despite the existence of medical records subjecting he is in Stage 4 chronic kidney disease, has had skin cancer, (basal and squamous cell carcinoma) and hypertension. MacDonald has been seen for his actinic keratosis or pre-cancerous proliferations that if left untreated, can develop into squamous cell carcinoma. Interestingly enough, he was first diagnosed with chronic kidney disease in 2007.
On November 11, 2020, MacDonald filed a motion in the North Carolina for a Compassionate release. Citing that because he is 77 years old, having served 39 years of his sentence (ii) is experiencing a serious deterioration in physical or mental health because of the aging process.
MacDonald currently works in Unicor in the engraving department as a quality and assurance inspector. (This is where license plates are produced.)
According to Hart Miles, The BOP has determined that MacDonald has a minimum risk of recidivating. Further stating MacDonald's minimum risk of recidivating is further supported by his age which corresponds to a reduced likelihood of recidivating according to the findings issued by the United States Sentencing Commission. Thus, MacDonald does not pose a danger to any other person or community.
Dr. Cyril Wecht has got into this as well, opining that his professional opinion "MacDonald requires specialized medical care at this time because of his advanced kidney disease and several other comorbidities."
The motion cites that the current life expectancy in the United States is 78.6 years. MacDonald now being 77 years old. Statistically, he has only one year of his life remaining.
Should MacDonald be released, he has a verifiable reentry plan. He will reside with his wife of more than 18 years who currently lives in Columbia, Maryland near FCI Cumberland where he is currently housed. She is familiar with him and his medical history, and who has agreed to house him and ensure that he complies with any conditions of release. She is also prepared to arrange COVID-19 testing and medical treatment by oncologists, nephrologists, cardiologists and any other medical specialists needed to treat his medical conditions.
They are pushing the what ifs here. What if he get COVID-19 he would need more specialized treatments than what the prison can provide.
Underlying the principle that the punishment should fit the offender and not merely the crime. This I do not agree with.
And that folks, is where we are. The motion has not been addressed as yet, and no parole request are being processed at this time.
The motion has 4 attorneys on it.
Hart Miles is the main one with Joseph Zeszotarski, Jr. The other two are new to the case.
Last edited by Christina Masewicz (2/19/2021 8:32 pm)
- Gwyka
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 12/06/2018
- Posts: 67
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Thank you Christina for all of the information on the latest activity. The federal law about compassionate release indicates he has to have been diagnosed with a terminal illness with less than 18 months to live, I wonder what the medical opinion of the staff actually treating him is. Seems to me that he's just plain getting old and has medical issues, but is not on his deathbed.
- Spifflog
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 10/05/2020
- Posts: 15
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
According to Hart Miles, The BOP has determined that MacDonald has a minimum risk of recidivating. Further stating MacDonald's minimum risk of recidivating is further supported by his age which corresponds to a reduced likelihood of recidivating according to the findings issued by the United States Sentencing Commission. Thus, MacDonald does not pose a danger to any other person or community.
Dr. Cyril Wecht has got into this as well, opining that his professional opinion "MacDonald requires specialized medical care at this time because of his advanced kidney disease and several other comorbidities."
The motion cites that the current life expectancy in the United States is 78.6 years. MacDonald now being 77 years old. Statistically, he has only one year of his life remaining.
Should MacDonald be released, he has a verifiable reentry plan. He will reside with his wife of more than 18 years who currently lives in Columbia, Maryland near FCI Cumberland where he is currently housed. She is familiar with him and his medical history, and who has agreed to house him and ensure that he complies with any conditions of release. She is also prepared to arrange COVID-19 testing and medical treatment by oncologists, nephrologists, cardiologists and any other medical specialists needed to treat his medical conditions.
They are pushing the what ifs here. What if he get COVID-19 he would need more specialized treatments than what the prison can provide. . .
The motion has 4 attorneys on it.
Hart Miles is the main one with Joseph Zeszotarski, Jr. The other two are new to the case.
Can't say as I like to read any of that. To see him a free man, with that arrogant smile on his face would drive me mad. I can't imagine what it would do to Colette's family.
- •
Thread Starter- Christina Masewicz
- Member
Offline
- Registered: 11/16/2018
- Posts: 65
Re: The worst "he's innocent" justification - lack of parole request
Thank you Christina for all of the information on the latest activity. The federal law about compassionate release indicates he has to have been diagnosed with a terminal illness with less than 18 months to live, I wonder what the medical opinion of the staff actually treating him is. Seems to me that he's just plain getting old and has medical issues, but is not on his deathbed.
You could be right Gwyka, and I hope you are. However, I am told that recently, the Department Of Justice has consistent with the Centers for Disease Control (CDC), identified certain risk factors that place inmates at a higher risk of complications from COVID-19. That an inmate that presents with one of the named CDC factors, as confirmed by medical records, and who is not expected to recover from that condition, is deemed to have established an extraordinary and compelling reason allowing for compassionate release. His records indicate 3 conditions. St 4 Chronic Kidney disease, HTN (Hypertension) and Skin cancer.
MacDonald was first diagnosed with Chronic kidney disease 2007, it doesn't list what stage at that time. It is now 2021. That is appropriately 14 years. I can find no records as to how over this time it has progressed other than it is now stage 4. It would appear he has done well since he is working, and involved in many prison actives.
So many things has changed because of COVID. It is my opinion the reason he has applied for a compassionate release is because of COVID-19 and all the what ifs that could occur to him should he get it.