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- OrangeTangerine
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
byn63 wrote:
There was another woman in NC that he considered a good friend, who was involved in his case, and they had a terribly bitter falling out because she wasn't being totally truthful with Jeff. Jeff said she was mentally ill and didn't share that with him. He said he could never have another casual conversation with her, but he didn't want to have an argument with her, so he asked my advice on how to cut her out of his life without her going ballistic because she was involved in his case. I know they did have a terrible falling out despite his wishes. I know Jeff simply called her and confronted her with the information. He sent me a whole pack of her letters to him, which were pretty romantic.
I've only ever heard of 1 COUPLE from NC that was at any time involved with inmate's case. It was a husband and wife pair that both wrote to inmate. Neither the husband nor the wife wanted to be romantic with inmate but they did at one time believe inmate was innocent. The pair did have a "falling out" of sorts, but not via telephone and not with inmate directly. Now, neither member of the couple believe inmate to be innocent.
Any other women from NC or anywhere else that wrote to inmate were NOT involved with inmate's case. There is plenty of documentation showing affidavits and who offered them to inmate at any time during the course of the years. I believe you have your facts very wrong on that alleged romance and fight.
He told me there was a married couple in NC, or maybe SC, I can't remember, who wrote him for a time, but they were only friends. He said he's been friends with both the husband and the wife. When I asked him if they were still friends, he said, no, they, meaning he and they, just sort of drifted apart. No acrimony on either side. Of course, that's what he said. I don't know the truth of the matter, but he seemed to be okay with the couple, and he admitted no romance. I never saw any of those letters, so maybe they only existed in his imagination. I don't know. I only know what Jeff said. I did see letters from a woman in NC, who had to have been a different woman, the one who was mentally ill. She had a lot of romantic fantasies about Jeff. A lot. She was very, very thin, blonde, looked physically ill. Like an anorexic. Had very little money. She was married, with one child, a girl, I think. Jeff even had a newspaper clipping about her helping in his case with her photo. She did some research for him. Jerry Potter had sent it to him. Jerry told me they, and he meant Fred, often sent Jeff newspaper clippings and photos concealed in books. Jerry talked about her a little. It was Jerry who told me about her mental illness before Jeff did. Either he or Fred had discovered it and told Jeff. Probably Jerry told Jeff because Jerry was way more talkative than Fred. At least I found him way more talkative. If there was a woman lying to Jeff about how she looked, I'd guess it was this woman because Jeff was shocked when Jerry showed him the newspaper photo. The photos she'd sent him were nothing like that and were of a much younger, dark haired woman, who was pretty and, as Jeff put it, "shapely." But I know this blonde woman didn't live in a trailer. She didn't live in a very nice house, but it was a house. I can't remember her name. It was a common name, but I can't remember it now. This was the mid-90s, and I've thought of a lot of stuff that's not Jeff since. I think Jeff only spoke to her once after Jerry told him about the mental illness. He confronted her with the truth, and that was that. Jeff could cut someone out of his life like cutting a bad spot out of an apple. He never thought twice about doing it.
I don't know much about the couple who wrote him, never saw any of their letters, but I do know I'm right about the blonde woman. That was confirmed by Jeff and by Jerry. She's probably the "woman in the trailer." When people tell things to other people, facts get distorted. I do know this particular woman in NC was infatuated with Jeff and sent him photos that were not her, but a trailer, no.
Last edited by OrangeTangerine (11/08/2019 10:16 pm)
- OrangeTangerine
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
I read that Inmate's brother told him about Kathryn's legal adventures, and his response was that it was none of his business and that Kathryn has given up "everything".
I read that, too, but didn't know if it was true. I think it probably is, but I don't know. I do know he found out about her shoplifting from a Maryland pharmacy, I think it was, and he defended her on that, but I think he knows the truth about her. She probably actually likes being married to him because he's tucked away in prison, and she doesn't have to clean for him or do his laundry or cook or cope with a real marriage, as in sharing a life. I don't think she could handle him and his bossiness and controlling attitude if he were free.
- Luminol
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
Wow, lots to digest there! Thanks for your insight. As i was reading, the thought going through my head on a loop was that it's tragic that he chose to cut his wife and daughters out of his life LITERALLY,instead of just leaving them to forge new, probably happier lives for themselves without him. So sad.
Last edited by Luminol (11/09/2019 4:06 pm)
- OneWhoCares
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
I've been reviewing my old notes on this case and came across the name I couldn't remember earlier. The painter's name is Renoir. The elderly woman writing to Inmate had a last name of Renoir or so she said. She wrote to him using that name but it is not clear if that was really her name or if she was related to the Renoirs. Does anybody know?
I believe I can clear some of the confusion up as to the woman who wrote to Jeffrey Macdonald during the mid 1990s and sent pictures of a dark haired model that was nothing close to what she looked like in real life. Actually Jim Blackburn and George Sloan traveled to Ohio to meet with her after she had called Jim on the phone and he had several conversations with her. She claimed that she had important information on the Jeffrey MacDonald case and would come to North Carolina and meet with him. She never did and so Jim And George traveled to Ohio to meet her in person. She showed them letters that she said were from MacDonald and claimed to be a descendant of the famous painter Renoir and also claimed to be very wealthy. He concluded that she was neither and that even the picture she emailed him of herself looked nothing like she did. She was born in 1948 and therefore was almost fifty years old at that time.
On November 8, 1988 this woman had her name changed to Renoir by falsely telling the court that she needed the name change in order to inherit an estate from her late grandfather in France. I communicated with Anne Renoir and she assured me that Gabrielle Ransbottom born (Patricia Jackson) was in no way related to the Renoirs.
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Thread Starter- OrangeTangerine
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
Jeff never mentioned anyone by that name to me, and of course I've never communicated with Mr. Blackburn or Mr. Sloan. I knew Joe McGinniss well, but he never mentioned anyone by that name, either. I did look up the name of the woman Jeff said was mentally ill. I don't feel right posting it for the world to see. She is, after all, mentally ill, but she is in NC. I think she's always lived there. It isn't the name of the woman you referenced, OWC. Not even the same initials. Jerry Potter verified this NC woman for Jeff. I don't think Jeff cared what a woman weighed if she thought him innocent. As for looks, as I said, look who he married! LOL He can't put too much stock in looks. I think it's great his "wife" got rid of her outdated hairstyle, but why on earth did she get it cut so short? Jeff hates short hair, that much I do know, and Kathryn seems to have very, very short hair. Was she ill? Did it fall out? Why did she take the site defending Jeff down?
- OrangeTangerine
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
Wow, lots to digest there! Thanks for your insight. As i was reading, the thought going through my head on a loop was that it's tragic that he chose to cut his wife and daughters out of his life LITERALLY,instead of just leaving them to forge new, probably happier lives for themselves without him. So sad.
Of course, it's tragic, but I don't think he meant to kill anyone when the argument started. I'm not defending him in any way. There is no defense for what he did. None. I think, though, that the killing of Kim was accidental, and then he thought the only way to save his "image" was to kill the others. I know some of you don't believe Kim's death was accidental. I still do because I don't believe Jeff would have damaged his "golden boy" image. He might have felt divorce would have done that. What others thought of him was everything to Jeff. Every time there would be a show on TV about his guilt or innocence, Jeff would call me immediately after wanting to know how innocent the show made him look.
Last edited by OrangeTangerine (11/11/2019 9:20 am)
- OneWhoCares
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
Jeff never mentioned anyone by that name to me, and of course I've never communicated with Mr. Blackburn or Mr. Sloan. I knew Joe McGinniss well, but he never mentioned anyone by that name, either. I did look up the name of the woman Jeff said was mentally ill. I don't feel right posting it for the world to see. She is, after all, mentally ill, but she is in NC. I think she's always lived there. It isn't the name of the woman you referenced, OWC. Not even the same initials. Jerry Potter verified this NC woman for Jeff. I don't think Jeff cared what a woman weighed if she thought him innocent. As for looks, as I said, look who he married! LOL He can't put too much stock in looks. I think it's great his "wife" got rid of her outdated hairstyle, but why on earth did she get it cut so short? Jeff hates short hair, that much I do know, and Kathryn seems to have very, very short hair. Was she ill? Did it fall out? Why did she take the site defending Jeff down?
I believe that he was talking about a crazy lady in Ohio because from the Vanity Fair article written Robert "Sam" Anson he writes:
Though still in jail, MacDonald was not lacking for female companionship. He had at least three would-be paramours: a radio talk-show host from Tucson, a law student from Michigan, and, strangest of all, an Ohio woman who claimed that she'd witnessed her lover killing Colette and the girls during a fight over her. MacDonald admits that he knew all three women, and that he had sent them stripped-to-the-waist beefcake pictures of himself, tucked inside sexually graphic billets-doux studded with "happy faces."
This would lead one to believe that the "crazy" woman lived in Ohio and not North Carolina. However, I am not surprised that he did not share that information with OrangeTangerine as he must have been totally humiliated to find out that he had been writing love letters to such a bat shit crazy person. That is not exactly something one would want to share with anyone. However, that is not to say there could not have been more than one crazy imposter that he was corresponding with. Sam Anson says the Ohio woman was the strangest of all and I totally believe him
Did he send you any of those stripped-to-the-waist pictures, OrangeTangerine? Can you share more of what his letters to you contaioned?
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Thread Starter- OrangeTangerine
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
Well, there certainly could be two strange or even crazy women who were writing to Jeff. I honestly believe there were more than two. I believe there were several, maybe many. I just know about the one in NC because Jeff talked to me about her and sent me some of her letters to him. He actually considered that woman a friend and felt betrayed because she didn't tell him she had so many mental issues. As soon as Jerry told him, he dropped her like the proverbial hot potato, and I know she was in NC because Jeff told me and Jerry told me. There were woman who dropped Jeff, too, when they found out he wasn't going to be as romantic or coddling as they expected. Jeff felt betrayed by them, too. He fully expected everyone to be on his side and believe him innocent. There were woman who'd write to Jeff and tell him they'd do "whatever it took" for him to be free even if it meant they had to lie. So, yes, I think several nutty women were writing him. Several, not many because Jeff simply didn't have the time to write to many. Only several.
In the beginning, Jeff sent me some photos of him with his shirt off. Looked like he'd been working out, but I really didn't find him all that attractive. He wasn't ugly or anything, but not attractive to me. Not my type. I like guys who aren't in prison and don't kill their families. Later, though, he didn't send me any stripped-to-the-waist photos, just regular photos. He never requested any improper photos from me, just photos, and he knew I sent him the real thing because I had visited him.
He would write about how he was fighting for his life, like he was truly innocent, and how much he needed me to move to Sheridan. He was pretty insistent on that, but I never would do it. I wasn't about to leave Los Angeles for anyone, even if I did want to be near Jeff, which I didn't care to be. He wrote about the things he wanted to do when he got out, like practice medicine again, get married, make friends, have BBQs, have kids - boys - and catch up on sports TV. He wrote romantic things, too. He would call almost daily, and always on days when some fool on TV was proclaiming that he just might be innocent. He would talk about how the investigators in NC got it all wrong. How they messed up the crime scene. I could actually agree with him that the crime scene was compromised but not that had it been preserved, it would prove him innocent. He talked about Lucia and how she was expecting to marry him but there was "too much water under the bridge" for that to go anywhere. I think he appreciated the research she was doing, though. He seemed sort of protective of her even though he said nothing romantic could come of their relationship.
Jeff would never talk about the night of the murders, though. Never. He wouldn't even give me his version of what happened.
I can see how some people believe Jeff is innocent. If they aren't familiar with the evidence, and they meet Jeff, he seems kind, polite, caring, intelligent, educated, even if a little formal and not too warm. But that's all a part of his public face. It's not the real Jeff. Have you ever noticed his signature on a letter? "Jeff" is written in huge letters compared to the rest of the letter. Signature of a narcissist.
One silly thing happened. After I terminated my relationship with Jeff, he must have given one of my photos and address to another prisoner. One day, some months after I stopped writing and seeing Jeff, a prisoner in Florida wrote me, and he had one of the photos I'd sent to Jeff! LOL This Florida guy was obviously running a con trying to get money out of me. I played along with him for a little while, about a month, then I contacted a newspaper reporter who'd written several articles about him. Then I wrote a letter back to the prisoner that let him know I was on to him. He tried to save his con, though he admitted to his lies. Some people never give up, I guess. Strange.
Edit: I read the "Vanity Fair" article. I see I was right. Several crazy women writing to Jeff. A woman in Michigan, one in Ohio, one in another state, one even visited him. The psychic was "in love" with him, by her own admission, Janet Malcolm became one of his followers, and on and on it goes. I sure never had any sexual encounters with him. Never visited with him in the attorney-client room, and he didn't ask me to do anything for him regarding his case like he asked that one women. He just wanted me to move to Sheridan so I could visit him regularly. No, I wasn't about to live in Oregon even if I had cared about Jeff. If he is, by some miracle, innocent, it's one of the worst miscarriages of justice in the US, if he's guilty, as I think he is, then he's one of the coldest people I've ever encountered.
Last edited by OrangeTangerine (11/11/2019 8:35 pm)
- OrangeTangerine
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
I can share this with you. This is one woman who used to live in NC, I think Raleigh, who wrote Jeff lots an lots of love letters and told people she was his girlfriend. LOL
I guess she moved her fantasies along to Johnny Mathis now! She is a real nutcase. Jeff sent me lots of her letters. Personally, I think she's totally demented and disconnected from reality. The photo on her FB page with Johnny Mathis was taken at a Cerritos, California Meet-and-Greet. He doesn't know her from the man in the moon. He'll meet with anyone for a minute or two after his show and take a photo. I was at that show. She was asking if she could give him a kiss, and he was telling her no, in a nice way.
Well, she's moved from an incarcerated family murderer to an octogenarian gay man, but she's still moved her fantasies up in the world.
Sad, but also hilarious. I can probably find her letters in the garage. Jeff, by the way, hated her.
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Last edited by OneWhoCares (11/14/2019 9:14 pm)
- OneWhoCares
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Re: How I became interested/involved in this case
I can share this with you. This is one woman who used to live in NC, I think Raleigh, who wrote Jeff lots an lots of love letters and told people she was his girlfriend. LOL
I guess she moved her fantasies along to Johnny Mathis now! She is a real nutcase. Jeff sent me lots of her letters. Personally, I think she's totally demented and disconnected from reality. The photo on her FB page with Johnny Mathis was taken at a Cerritos, California Meet-and-Greet. He doesn't know her from the man in the moon. He'll meet with anyone for a minute or two after his show and take a photo. I was at that show. She was asking if she could give him a kiss, and he was telling her no, in a nice way.
Well, she's moved from an incarcerated family murderer to an octogenarian gay man, but she's still moved her fantasies up in the world.
Sad, but also hilarious. I can probably find her letters in the garage. Jeff, by the way, hated her.
That is very interesting. Did he actually say he hated her? What did she do that made him say that?
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